I have two applications.
One inserts data into database continuously like it is having an infinity loop.
When the second application inserts data to same database and table what will happen.
If it waits till the other application to complete inserting which will handle this?
Or it will say it is busy?
Or code throws an exception?
SQL servers have something called a connection pool which means that more than once connection to the database can be made at any particular time, and that's where the easy bit ends.
If you were to for example connect to the database on two applications at the same time and insert data in to different tables from each application then the two could happily happen at the same time without issue.
If however those applications wanted to do something like edit the same row then there's an issue with "locking" ...
Essentially any operation on a SQL database requires "acquiring a lock" on a "set" or "row" or "cell" depending on the configuration of the server its hard to say what might happen in your case.
So the simple answer is:
Yes, SQL can make stuff happen (like inserts) at the same time but with some clauses.
And long answer ...
requires in depth knowledge of locking and your database and server configuration.
I've been using Access to rapid-prototype a DB. Now I'd like to do a small group online test so I split the DB and placed the back-end on Azure SQL Server, then re-linked. It's incredibly slow and I've been researching solutions for days without positive results. My local environment is Win10, Office2016 64bit and internet connection is fast and stable.
I have tried different ODBC drivers, including the SQL Native Client v11.
I've disabled auto-tuning level on the NIC.
I've recreated all queries from access on the server.
I've made sure that Tracing in ODBC is off.
But I enabled tracing temporarily to see what was happening. If I opened the front-end, logged in (Small user table), and did something on the first form (Add 1 record with 3 sub-records...and really...nothing fancy or heavy at all and this only takes 1 minute) then closed the DB, I see that the Tracing log file is 1.5MB.
So I created an empty Access file and an ODBC link to only the User table (12 columns, 20 records), and then monitored the tracing log file again. Opening access doesn't add anything to the log file, but opening this one, linked table made the log file grow to 255kb. Opening this table in access took 5 seconds.
Access sent about 800 requests to the server for opening just this one small table. If I paste all the User table data into a text file, it's only 2kb. SO why is it so slow?
Any ideas on this, and specifically other suggestions to get this working faster?
Kind regards,
Well, the reason why using Azure is slower than running Access connected to a local instance of SQL server is because, well slow is slow!
I mean, if you going to travel 30 miles, you have a choice to walk, or to take a car.
So here is the question you need to know:
Why is walking slower than driving a car?
Answer: Because you are travelling at a slower speed!
So why is using Azure slower the using an instance of SQL server running on your local computer or local network?
Answer:
Because the connection speed to Azure is about 100 times slower!
The idea here that you not going to take into account the DIFFERENCE in connection speed is the issue here. It is a disservice to the reading public that may conclude that such a setup (Access front end on a pc to Azure instance of SQL server) is not a viable setup.
So the first issue here is to make a note of your connection speed to the back end database.
A typical office local area network has a speed of 100mbits, or today most are 1gig – even the el-cheapo routers you purchase at Best Buy are now rated at 1gig (1000 mbits).
However, your typical high speed internet is rated at about 5, or 10 mbits. So that is 100 times slower. (Actually 1000/5 = 200 times slower!!!).
That means if something NOW takes 3 seconds on your office network with Access and SQL server? Well then a WAN (over the internet), then you need to multiple the time by the change in your connection speed (this is so simple – yet it seems to escape all!). So, if you lucky, you might have a 5 mbits speed rating for your internet. That means you go
1000 / 5 = 200
You now take the 200 and multiple the existing delay you have of say 3 seconds and you get 600 seconds (that is 10 minutes if you are wondering!). So you going from 3 seconds to 10 minutes!
This kind of comparison in speed would be like walking into a sports shop to purchase a rubber boat to cross the Atlantic. So not taking into account the change in internet speed and wondering why things are slow is the issue here.
You can most certainly use Access to Azure, but you have to realize two simple concepts.
a connection and test with a connection that is 50-200 times slower than your LAN is a test that going to run 50 to 200 times slower! The failure to mention and take into considering the MASSIVE DIFFERENCE in your speed connection of your LAN compared to a WAN is the simple issue here.
opening a form bound to a large table of data is going to case performance issues.
I was sitting at the bus stop talking to a 90 year old granny lady. I asked her the following:
Have you ever used an instant teller?
She said, why yes, I use them all the time.
I then asked here don’t you think it would be bad to have the teller machine download all the peoples accounts while you wait and THEN ask you for your account number?
The old lady stated, of course, that would be silly. I type in my account pin and the machine ONLY downloads my account information – this is practical and obvious.
In other words that old lady realised that downloading a bunch of data BEFORE you the user even types in or does anything is a waste of bandwidth.
So you never want to launch a form bound to a table and THEN ask the user what record to work on. Why have Access download large numbers of records into a form and THEN ask the user or allow the user to navigate to the required record?
Even when using Google, it does not download the whole internet into your web browser page and you then go ctrl+f to search the contents of that web page.
The same concepts should be applied to Access applications. A design that asks for what to work on and then launches a form bound to a table with a "where" clause will thus fix this issue.
So if you have a form (and even a sub form) that displays a customer invoice, you would FIRST ASK FOR the invoice number, and then simply launch that form using a where clause that restricts the form to the ONE invoice!
Keep in mind that you can STILL use that invoice form bound to a table of 1 million rows and ONLY THE ONE record will be pulled down the network connection *if one used the where clause.
So a typical internet connection has adequate speed to run a browser, and also has MORE than adequate bandwidth speed to pull down a few records. Access often gets a bad rap for poor performance, but that is ONLY DUE to Access developers IGNORING the obvious advice that downloading tons of things that you don’t yet need into a form will run slow.
So web based applications, or even desktop applications written in vb.net perform well with SQL Azure running in the cloud over that MUCH slower internet connection because those applications don’t launch forms bound to large datasets WITHOUT FIRST simply allowing the user to request what they need to see and view.
As for Access and using SharePoint? That setup can be VERY fast, and in fact MUCH faster than SQL Azure, MySQL or any traditional database system because when you using SharePoint tables and Access, then Access automatic syncs a copy of the data local. This setup means your application will continue to run WITHOUT ANY internet connection. The instant the connection is restored, then the data sync can resume.
This means that if you have a table with 15,000 rows and run a report on that data the report can run and launch in an instant with SharePoint back end since a local copy of the data exists in the front end at ALL TIMES! So this setup is VERY well suited an off line mode or in cases that you have a poor and slow internet connections since you as noted always have local copy of the data – only when a record is changed does a sync occur, and that sync can occur independent of Access. So you change one record – and it starts syncing with SharePoint.
However for larger data sets that have to be updated, then SQL server is far better since you can execute a sql update on 10,000 rows and ZERO network traffic and transfer of data need occur to update those 10,000 rows when using SQL server (a pass through query) and when using SharePoint, the 10,000 rows WILL transfer over the network since the local copy requires the rows to be updated. So that massive advantage of using SharePoint for the database backend does not exist for applications that have to update lots of rows or do lots of row update types of data processing.
So the key concepts and take away here:
The high speed internet connection you have is often 10-200 times slower than your typical cheap office (local) network. So that means a 2 second operation will now take 10-200 times longer.
The Access application needs to be optimized to avoid things like loading too many records into a form. So building search forms etc. That FIRST ASK the user what they need to work on is a basic and simple requirement for all good developers and that includes Access developers.
Access and SharePoint can be the BEST option, and such a setup allows the application to run EVEN WHEN there is no internet connection at all. If table sizes are below say 10,000 rows, then this setup can often be ideal. However for applications that have to update lots of rows and for data processing heavy applications this setup is poor since updates to any rows will case data syncing to occur over the network. This setup is also the cheapest, since a single office 365 account with SharePoint support for Access can be had for $6 per month, and that $6 account allows up to 500 free users and those 500 users can even use their Gmail or non-Microsoft account for this setup. And such access applications that do fit within the bounds of SharePoint tables tend to need far less changes and optimizing then using SQL server over the internet.
With SQL server, use of views, pass-tough query and in some cases writing store procedures allows updates and code to run WITHOUT using ANY bandwidth. So one can send a single update query to the server that updates 10,000 rows of data – the only network cost will be the “tiny” amount of bandwidth to send that sql statement.
So while bound forms can be used with SQL Azure running in the cloud, one needs to build software like those do for the web, or vb.net in which they FIRST ask the user what account or customer to work on and THEN launch the UI to display that given data.
So in access, you build a search form say like this:
So at the end of the day, it is important to ignore posts here that suggests Access to SQL in the cloud is not viable. Access with proper designs will work rather well over typical internet connections to SQL server running on Azure.
In fact I seen people use Access to SQL over a 56k modem!
One has to adopt sensible designs in which the data pulled for a given task is restricted – this is a hall mark of all developers – the only issue is Access does NOT enforce this approach while most other developer tools don’t let you hang yourself with things like bound forms to large tables! It not that Access is slow, but Access is slow when you make poor design decisions.
Access to SharePoint can be a real winner – especially for poor bandwidth, spotty bandwidth and even when the connection is lost, the application will continue to run and run faster than 99% of the cases if you were running the same application with a SQL back end. There is a BIG caveat here since only certain types of applications will work well with SharePoint tables. For me to explain the why, how, and when such applications are better is beyond a simple post here, but one simply needs to be aware that SharePoint can be incredible solution, but not for all applications and SQL server can and will be better choice. This SharePoint “better” choice can only be determined on a case by case evaluation of the given type of application in question.
The problem is simply that Azure SQL Database is not very fast running with small DTUs (Database Transaction Units) compared to, say, an in-house instance of SQL Server hosted on even a moderate modern server.
I've checked it out too, and it requires extremely careful design of queries and filtering - far from what you normally can get away with - to obtain acceptable overall speed. On the other hand, this is a giving experience that will bring focus to potential bottlenecks you otherwise wouldn't encounter before it might be too late.
OK, so after almost a week of trying to get this to work (Access front-end to SQL Server back-end on Azure), I've come to the conclusion that it's not a viable solution.
I've tried SQL Server, and setup a Sharepoint 2016 server on Azure, which also failed.
What has worked is using a product from Bullzipp called MS Access to MySQL to convert the access tables, then adding a MySQL DB on the server and importing the file generated by Bullzip. The only thing to note here is that Bullzip doesn't like the newer access formats (it wants an MDB file) so go to Access, create a new, empty file, but make sure you set its file type to MDB. then import your tables across and run Bullzip.
It's now working a hell of a lot faster than the SQL Server, but I am getting some write conflicts in Access, so I just need to go through the code and do whatever I need to so I can avoid those messages.
Using Access as a front to Azure SQL tables is the worst solution. But, sometimes you have to do it. I have a client who is adamant that she wants to keep her Access database. When she hired her very first employee, it became clear she needed to SQL tables behind the screens.
This was a bit of a nightmare. However, after redesigning some terrible table structures, creating views and many procs, I've been able to do it. I use local tables in some cases, and refill by pulling from a stored proc and inserting into the local table. I use linked tables for basic data edits, and do explicit save records almost constantly.
I also have a first-load module that opens all forms, goes to the last record, back to the first record, and then hides the form until needed. The load limps along for about 3
My only remaining issue is now that Azure will close connections after idle time of (I think) 30 or more minutes -- or maybe it's when the laptop sleeps? That kills the app and it has to be closed and re-opened.
I have a problem with my MS Access database file that is used shared on a network. Sometimes when i try to make an update to the data, is says record locking by 'PC 1'..already try check option same like this picture but still cannot solve. Sometime it locks by itself also cannot open that file.
enter image description here
Note : Window XP
I also have a MS Access db that is on a shared network. It is not uncommon for a user to entering data, while another is updated/deleting information within the tables. If I understand your question correctly, you would like to be able to update the information regardless of whether or not someone else's machine is in the database.
Solution:
Create a db shell that has linked tables to the functional database. An advantage of this technique is that by having users interact with the shell, you can prevent the database from being locked by a machine. In addition, it allows multiple users to access and edit the information within the database, without running into record locking issues.
Hope this helps.
I am using Access 2013 and Sql Server 2012. I have upsized the access application to Sql Server using linked tables. I have an Access query (not on SQL server) that provides a result from about 4 tables. I then have this displayed in a bound layout/table view where each row corresponds to a row from the result query.
In the layout view, the user can edit the data in any row. Once the user does an edit, apparently Access opens a transaction and keeps it open. As long as the user is in the editable layout view, the tables that were part of the query are locked. If another user on a different computer is using Access, then they are unable to edit any of the tables (through any method, not just the same layout view). The 2nd user will get a 30 second pause in their application, and then finally will get error...
ODBC-update on a linked table 'TableName' failed.
[Microsoft][ODBC Sql Server DRiver]Query timeout expired (#0)
Once the first user exits the layout view, then all is opened up again for other users to edit.
Is there any way to control the transaction? Maybe just have it update the one row, and then release the transaction.
May have to change the data source for the layout view to be a SQL Server Sproc or View and not allow edits in the table. Instead, if the user wants to change something in a row, then click to bring up an edit form. Looking for other options.
You have a few possible solutions.
One solution is to open the form in question with a where clause to ONLY thus open the one row, not many rows.
The above is only practical suggestion if the form in question is NOT a continues form.
So you go:
strInvoice = inputbox("What invoice to work on")
docmd.Openform "frmInvoice",,,"[invoiceNum] = " & strInvoice
So limiting the form to the one row will fix this assuming there is an index on the invoice column. Also such a design tends to be more user friendly. I explain this important search concept here:
http://www.kallal.ca/Search/index.html
Another way to fix this issue is to FORCE fill the form with all records (this is really a bad idea from a performance point of view, and even without SQL server launching a form WITHOUT ANY kind of where clause as I show above is a bad idea from a user point of view, and also from a performance point of view)..
The reason why the table lock often occurs is the form starts pulling data from SQL server but then Access says HEY WAIT I have enough data – but the queries that started on SQL server already fired off some table locks and ASSUMED that all rows would be returned to the client (so the client halting the flow of records is what really causes your locks). What you can do to prevent this issue is thus execute a move last to pull all records, and thus that will eliminate (release) the table locks.
So in the forms on-load event, you can go:
me.recordset.MoveLast
me.recordset.MoveFirst
As noted the problem here is that pulling all records into a form is a VERY bad design in the first place.
Last by not least:
Another way to eliminate the table lock is to build the query as a view SQL server side and include the NOLOCK hint. You then setup a link to the view, and based the form NOT on a local query, but that of the view. Since the view has a NOLOCK hint, then you don’t need the movelast/movefirst suggestion as per above.
So out of the several solutions here, opening the form to ONE record is really the recommended solution. I mean when you walk up to an instant teller machine, it does not download EVERY account and THEN ask you what account to work on. When you use a search engine such as google, then it does not download the WHOLE internet and THEN ask you what to search for. Even an old lady at the bus stop can figure this out, let alone someone writing software!
So when you design + build a form in Access, it makes VERY little sense to download all records from the table into the form and THEN let the user search. So the user needs to be prompted for what to work on BEFORE the form is loaded, and if you use a where clause when opening the form EVEN if the form is bound to a large linked table to SQL server ONLY the record(s) that match the where clause will be pulled down into that form.
If you don’t use the where clause, then as noted, the locking issue will rear its ugly head.
As a temp fix, try the movelast/movefirst in the forms on-load, as that should fix the locking issue. However for longer term, I would suggest using a where clause, or consider the view idea.
Note that if you have ANY combo box based on any of the 4 tables, then AGAIN will you find locking issues since the combo box will request the data (and SQL server places a table lock during that request). And AGAIN Access will THEN tell sql server to please stop loading up the combo box since all rows are NOT yet required (but too late, as the table lock has occurred).
So if you have ANY combo box in that form based on any of the tables used, then again you find table locks occur. In these cases, I would again suggest basing the combo boxes on either pass-through quires with the NO LOCK hint, or on views with again the no-lock hint.
So check the form for any combo box based on any of those tables – they will cause table locks also.
disclaimer: I must use a microsoft access database and I cannot connect my app to a server to subscribe to any service.
I am using VB.net to create a WPF application. I am populating a listview based on records from an access database which I query one time when the application loads and I fill a dataset. I then use LINQ to dataset to display data to the user depending on filters and whatnot.
However.. the access table is modified many times throughout the day which means the user will have "old data" as the day progresses if they do not reload the application. Is there a way to connect the access database to the VB.net application such that it can raise an event when a record is added, removed, or modified in the database? I am fine with any code required IN the event handler.. I just need to figure out a way to trigger a vb.net application event from the access table.
Think of what I am trying to do as viewing real-time edits to a database table, but within the application.. any help is MUCH appreciated and let me know if you require any clarification - I just need a general direction and I am happy to research more.
My solution idea:
Create audit table for ms access change
Create separate worker thread within the users application to query
the audit table for changes every 60 seconds
if changes are found it will modify the affected dataset records
Raise event on dataset record update to refresh any affected
objects/properties
Couple of ways to do what you want, but you are basically right in your process.
As far as I know, there is no direct way to get events from the database drivers to let you know that something changed, so polling is the only solution.
I the MS Access database is an Access 2010 ACCDB database, and you are using the ACE drivers for it (if Access is not installed on the machine where the app is running) you can use the new data macro triggers to record changes to the tables in the database automatically to an audit table that would record new inserts of updates, deletes, etc as needed.
This approach is the best since these happen at the ACE database driver level, so they will be as efficient as possible and transparent.
If you are using older versions of Access, then you will have to implement the auditing yourself. Allen Browne has a good article on that. A bit of search will bring other solutions as well.
You can also just run some query on the tables you need to monitor
In any case, you will need to monitor your audit or data table as you mentioned.
You can monitor for changes much frequently than 60s, depending on the load on the database, number of clients, etc, you could easily check ever few seconds.
I would recommend though that you:
Keep a permanent connection to the database while your app is running: open a dummy table for reading, and don't close it until you shutdown your app. This has no performance cost to anyone, but it will ensure that the expensive lock file creation is done only once, and not for every query you run. This can have a huge performance import. See this article for more information on why.
Make it easy for your audit table (or for your data table) to be monitored: include a timestamp column that records when a record was created and last modified. This makes checking for changes very quick and efficient: you just need to check if the most recent record modified date matches the last one you read.
With Access 2010, it's easy to add the trigger to do that. With older versions, you'll need to do that at the level of the form.
If you are using SQL Server
Up to SQL 2005 you could use Notification Services
Since SQL Server 2008 R2 it has been replaced by StreamInsight
Other database management systems and alternatives
Oracle
Handle changes in a middle tier and signal the client
Or poll. This requires you to configure the interval so you do not miss out on a change too long.
In general
When a server has to be able to send messages to clients it needs to keep a channel/socket open to the clients this can become very expensive when there are a lot of clients. I would advise against a server push and try to do intelligent polling. Intelligent polling means an interval that is as big as possible and appropriate caching on the server to prevent hitting the database to many times for the same data.