I wrote a Gibbs sampler in R and decided to port it to C to see whether it would be faster. A lot of pages I have looked at claim that C will be up to 50 times faster, but every time I have used it, it's only about five or six times faster than R. My question is: is this to be expected, or are there tricks which I am not using which would make my C code significantly faster than this (like how using vectorization speeds up code in R)? I basically took the code and rewrote it in C, replacing matrix operations with for loops and making all the variables pointers.
Also, does anyone know of good resources for C from the point of view of an R programmer? There's an excellent book called The Art of R Programming by Matloff, but it seems to be written from the perspective of someone who already knows C.
Also, the screen tends to freeze when my C code is running in the standard R GUI for Windows. It doesn't crash; it unfreezes once the code has finished running, but it stops me from doing anything else in the GUI. Does anybody know how I could avoid this? I am calling the function using .C()
Many of the existing posts have explicit examples you can run, for example Darren Wilkinson has several posts on his blog analyzing this in different languages, and later even on different hardware (eg comparing his high-end laptop to his netbook and to a Raspberry Pi). Some of his posts are
the initial (then revised) post
another later post
and there are many more on his site -- these often compare C, Java, Python and more.
Now, I also turned this into a version using Rcpp -- see this blog post. We also used the same example in a comparison between Julia, Python and R/C++ at useR this summer so you should find plenty other examples and references. MCMC is widely used, and "easy pickings" for speedups.
Given these examples, allow me to add that I disagree with the two earlier comments your question received. The speed will not be the same, it is easy to do better in an example such as this, and your C/C++ skills will mostly determines how much better.
Finally, an often overlooked aspect is that the speed of the RNG matters a lot. Running down loops and adding things up is cheap -- doing "good" draws is not, and a lot of inter-system variation comes from that too.
About the GUI freezing, you might want to call R_CheckUserInterrupt and perhaps R_ProcessEvents every now and then.
I would say C, done properly, is much faster than R.
Some easy gains you could try:
Set the compiler to optimize for more speed.
Compiling with the -march flag.
Also if you're using VS, make sure you're compiling with release options, not debug.
Your observed performance difference will depend on a number of things: the type of operations that you are doing, how you write the C code, what type of compiler-level optimizations you use, your target CPU architecture, etc etc.
You can write basic, sloppy C and get something that works and runs with decent efficiency. You can also fine-tune your code for the unique characteristics of your target CPU - perhaps invoking specialized assembly instructions - and squeeze every last drop of performance that you can out of the code. You could even write code that runs significantly slower than the R version. C gives you a lot of flexibility. The limiting factor here is how much time that you want to put into writing and optimizing the C code.
The reverse is also true (duplicate the previous paragraph here, but swap "C" and "R").
I'm not trying to sound facetious, but there's really not a straightforward answer to your question. The only way to tell how much faster your C version would be is to write the code both ways and benchmark them.
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It seems to be a mainstream opinion that assembly programming takes longer and is more difficult to program in than a higher level language such as C. Therefore it seems to be recommend or assumed that it is better to write in a higher level language for these reasons and for the reason of better portability.
Recently I've been writing in x86 assembly and it has dawned on me that perhaps these reasons are not really true, except perhaps portability. Perhaps it is more of a matter of familiarity and knowing how to write assembly well. I also noticed that programming in assembly is quite different than programming in an HLL. Perhaps a good and experienced assembly programmer could write programs just as easily and as quickly as an experienced C programmer writing in C.
Perhaps it is because assembly programming is quite different than HLLs, and so requires different thinking, methods and ways, which makes it seem very awkward to program in for the unfamiliar, and so gives it its bad name for writing programs in.
If portability isn't an issue, then really, what would C have over a good assembler such as NASM?
Edit:
Just to point out. When you are writing in assembly, you don't have to write just in instruction codes. You can use macros and procedures and your own conventions to make various abstractions to make programs more modular, more maintainable and easier to read. This is where being familiar with how to write good assembly comes in.
HellŠ¾, I am a compiler.
I just scanned thousands of lines of code while you were reading this sentence. I browsed through millions of possibilities of optimizing a single line of yours using hundreds of different optimization techniques based on a vast amount of academic research that you would spend years getting at. I won't feel any embarrassment, not even a slight ick, when I convert a three-line loop to thousands of instructions just to make it faster. I have no shame to go to great lengths of optimization or to do the dirtiest tricks. And if you don't want me to, maybe for a day or two, I'll behave and do it the way you like. I can transform the methods I'm using whenever you want, without even changing a single line of your code. I can even show you how your code would look in assembly, on different processor architectures and different operating systems and in different assembly conventions if you'd like. Yes, all in seconds. Because, you know, I can; and you know, you can't.
P.S. Oh, by the way you weren't using half of the code you wrote. I did you a favor and threw it away.
ASM has poor legibility and isn't really maintainable compared to higher-level languages.
Also, there are many fewer ASM developers than for other more popular languages, such as C.
Furthermore, if you use a higher-level language and new ASM instructions become available (SSE for example), you just need to update your compiler and your old code can easily make use of the new instructions.
What if the next CPU has twice as many registers?
The converse of this question would be: What functionality do compilers provide?
I doubt you can/want to/should optimize your ASM better than gcc -O3 can.
I've written shedloads of assembler for the 6502, Z80, 6809 and 8086 chips. I stopped doing so as soon as C compilers became available for the platforms I was addressing, and immediately became at least 10x more productive. Most good programmers use the tools they use for rational reasons.
I love programming in assembly language, but it takes more code to do the same thing as in a high-level languge, and there is a direct correlation between lines of code and bugs. (This was explained decades ago in The Mythical Man-Month.)
It's possible to think of C as 'high level assembly', but get a few steps above that and you're in a different world. In C# you don't think twice about writing this:
foreach (string s in listOfStrings) { /* do stuff */ }
This would be dozens, maybe hundreds of lines of code in assembly, each programmer implementing it would take a different approach, and the next person coming along would have to figure it out. So if you believe (as many do) that programs are written primarily for other people to read, assembly is less readable than the typical HLL.
Edit: I accumulated a personal library of code used for common tasks, and macros for implementing C-like control structures. But I hit the wall in the 90s, when GUIs became the norm. Too much time was being spent on things that were routine.
The last task I had where ASM was essential was a few years ago, writing code to combat malware. No user interface, so it was all the fun parts without the bloat.
In addition to other people's answers of readability, maintainability, shorter code and therefore fewer bugs, and being much easier, I'll add an additional reason:
program speed.
Yes, in assembly you can hand tune your code to make use of every last cycle and make it as fast as is physically possible. However who has the time? If you write a not-completely-stupid C program, the compiler will do a really good job of optimizing for you. Probably making at least 95% of the optimizations you'd do by hand, without you having to worry about keeping track of any of it. There's definitely a 90/10 kind of rule here, where that last 5% of optimizations will end up taking up 95% of your time. So why bother?
If an average production program has say 100k lines of code, and each line is about 8-12 assembler instructions, that would be 1 million of assembler instructions.
Even if you could write all this by hand at a decent speed (remember, its 8 times more code that you have to write), what happens if you want to change some of the functionality? Understanding something you wrote a few weeks ago out of those 1 million instructions is a nightmare! There's no modules, no classes, no object-oriented design, no frameworks, no nothing. And the amount of similar looking code you have to write for even the simplest things is daunting at best.
Besides, you can't optimize your code nearly as well as a high level language. Where C for example performs an insane number of optimizations because you describe your intent, not only your code, in assembler you only write code, the assembler can't really perform any note-worthy optimizations on your code. What you write is what you get, and trust me, you can't reliably optimize 1 million instructions that you patch and patch as you write it.
Well I have been writing a lot of assembly "in the old days", and I can assure you that I am much more productive when I write programs in a high level language.
A reasonable level of assembler competence is a useful skill, especially if you work at any sort of system level or embedded programming, not so much because you have to write that much assembler, but because sometimes it's important to understand what the box is really doing. If you don't have a low-level understanding of assembler concepts and issues, this can be very difficult.
However, as for actually writing much code in assembler, there are several reasons it's not much done.
There's simply no (almost) need. Except for something like the very early system initialization and perhaps a few assembler fragments hidden in C functions or macros, all very low-level code that might once have been written in assembler can be written in C or C++ with no difficulty.
Code in higher-level languages (even C and C++) condenses functionality into far fewer lines, and there is considerable research showing that the number of bugs correlates with the number of lines of source code. Ie, the same problem, solved in assembler and C, will have more bugs in assembler simply because its longer. The same argument motivates the move to higher level languages such as Perl, Python, etc.
Writing in assembler, you have to deal with every single aspect of the problem, from detailed memory layout, instruction selection, algorithm choices, stack management, etc. Higher level languages take all this away from you, which is why are so much denser in terms of LOC.
Essentially, all of the above are related to the level of abstraction available to you in assembler versus C or some other language. Assembler forces you to make all of your own abstractions, and to maintain them through your own self-discipline, where any mid-level language like C, and especially higher level languages, provide you with abstractions out of the box, as well as the ability to create new ones relatively easily.
As a developer who spends most of his time in the embedded programming world, I would argue that assembly is far from a dead/obsolete language. There is a certain close-to-the-metal level of coding (for example, in drivers) that sometimes cannot be expressed as accurately or efficiently in a higher-level language. We write nearly all of our hardware interface routines in assembler.
That being said, this assembly code is wrapped such that it can be called from C code and is treated like a library. We don't write the entire program in assembly for many reasons. First and foremost is portability; our code base is used on several products that use different architectures and we want to maximize the amount of code that can be shared between them. Second is developer familiarity. Simply put, schools don't teach assembly like they used to, and our developers are far more productive in C than in assembly. Also, we have a wide variety of "extras" (things like libraries, debuggers, static analysis tools, etc) available for our C code that aren't available for assembly language code. Even if we wanted to write a pure-assembly program, we would not be able to because several critical hardware libraries are only available as C libs. In one sense, it's a chicken/egg problem. People are driven away from assembly because there aren't as many libraries and development/debug tools available for it, but the libs/tools don't exist because not enough people use assembly to warrant the effort creating them.
In the end, there is a time and a place for just about any language. People use what they are most familiar and productive with. There will probably always be a place in a programmer's repertoire for assembly, but most programmers will find that they can write code in a higher-level language that is almost as efficient in far less time.
When you are writing in assembly, you don't have to write just in instruction codes. You can use macros and procedures and your own conventions to make various abstractions to make programs more modular, more maintainable and easier to read.
So what you're basically saying is, that with skilled use of a sophisticated assembler, you can make your ASM code closer and closer to C (or anyway another low-ish-level language of your own invention), until eventually you are just as productive as a C programmer.
Does that answer your question? ;-)
I don't say this idly: I have programmed using exactly such an assembler and system. Even better, the assembler could target a virtual processor, and a separate translator compiled the output of the assembler for a target platform. Much as happens with LLVM's IF, but in its early forms pre-dating it by about 10 years. So there was portability, plus the ability to write routines for a specific target asssembler where required for efficiency.
Writing using that assembler was about as productive as C, and with by comparison with GCC-3 (which was around by the time I was involved) the assembler/translator produced code that was roughly as fast and usually smaller. Size was really important, and the company had few programmers and was willing to teach new hires a new language before they could do anything useful. And we had the back-up that people who didn't know the assembler (e.g. customers) could write C and compile it for the same virtual processor, using the same calling convention and so on, so that it interfaced neatly. So it felt like a marginal win.
That was with multiple man-years of work in the bag developing the assembler technology, libraries, and so on. Admittedly much of which went into making it portable, if it had only ever been targeting one architecture then the all-singing all-dancing assembler would have been much easier.
In summary: you may not like C, but it doesn't mean that the effort of using C is greater than the effort of coming up with something better.
Assembly is not portable between different microprocessors.
The same reason we don't go to the bathroom outside anymore, or why we don't speak Latin or Aramaic.
Technology comes along and makes things easier and more accessible.
EDIT - to cease offending people, I've removed certain words.
Why? Simple.
Compare this :
for (var i = 1; i <= 100; i++)
{
if (i % 3 == 0)
Console.Write("Fizz");
if (i % 5 == 0)
Console.Write("Buzz");
if (i % 3 != 0 && i % 5 != 0)
Console.Write(i);
Console.WriteLine();
}
with
.locals init (
[0] int32 i)
L_0000: ldc.i4.1
L_0001: stloc.0
L_0002: br.s L_003b
L_0004: ldloc.0
L_0005: ldc.i4.3
L_0006: rem
L_0007: brtrue.s L_0013
L_0009: ldstr "Fizz"
L_000e: call void [mscorlib]System.Console::Write(string)
L_0013: ldloc.0
L_0014: ldc.i4.5
L_0015: rem
L_0016: brtrue.s L_0022
L_0018: ldstr "Buzz"
L_001d: call void [mscorlib]System.Console::Write(string)
L_0022: ldloc.0
L_0023: ldc.i4.3
L_0024: rem
L_0025: brfalse.s L_0032
L_0027: ldloc.0
L_0028: ldc.i4.5
L_0029: rem
L_002a: brfalse.s L_0032
L_002c: ldloc.0
L_002d: call void [mscorlib]System.Console::Write(int32)
L_0032: call void [mscorlib]System.Console::WriteLine()
L_0037: ldloc.0
L_0038: ldc.i4.1
L_0039: add
L_003a: stloc.0
L_003b: ldloc.0
L_003c: ldc.i4.s 100
L_003e: ble.s L_0004
L_0040: ret
They're identical feature-wise.
The second one isn't even assembler but .NET IL (Intermediary Language, similar to Java's bytecode). The second compilation transforms the IL into native code (i.e. almost assembler), making it even more cryptical.
I'd guess ASM on even x86(_64) makes sense in cases where you gain a lot by utilizing instructions that are difficult for a compiler to optimize for. x264 for example uses a lot of asm for its encoding, and the speed gains are huge.
I'm sure there are many reasons, but two quick reasons I can think of are
Assembly code is definitely harder to read (I'm positive its more time-consuming to write as well)
When you have a huge team of developers working on a product, it is helpful to have your code divided into logical blocks and protected by interfaces.
One of the early discoveries (you'll find it in Brooks' Mythical Man-Month, which is from experience in the 1960s) was that people were more or less as productive in one language as another, in debugged lines of code per day. This obviously isn't universally true, and can breaks when pushed too far, but it was generally true of the high-level languages of Brooks' time.
Therefore, the fastest way to get productivity would be to use languages where one individual line of code did more, and indeed this works, at least for languages of complexity like FORTRAN and COBOL, or to give a more modern example C.
Portability is always an issue -- if not now, at least eventually. The programming industry spends billions every year to port old software which, at the time it was written, had "obviously" no portability issue whatsoever.
There was a vicious cycle as assembly became less commonplace: as higher level languages matured, assembly language instruction sets were built less for programmer convenience and more for the convenience of compilers.
So now, realistically, it may be very hard to make the right decisions on, say, which registers you should use or which instructions are slightly more efficient. Compilers can use heuristics to figure out which tradeoffs are likely to have the best payoff. We can probably think through smaller problems and find local optimizations that might beat our now pretty sophisticated compilers, but odds are that in the average case, a good compiler will do a better job on the first try than a good programmer probably will. Eventually, like John Henry, we might beat the machine, but we might seriously burn ourselves out getting there.
Our problems are also now quite different. In 1986 I was trying to figure out how to get a little more speed out of small programs that involved putting a few hundred pixels on the screen; I wanted the animation to be less jerky. A fair case for assembly language. Now I'm trying to figure out how to represent abstractions around contract language and servicer policy for mortgages, and I'd rather read something that looks close to the language that the business folks speak. Unlike LISP macros, Assembly macros don't enforce much in the way of rules, so even though you might be able to get something reasonably close to a DSL in a good assembler, it'll be prone to all sorts of quirks that won't cause me problems if I wrote the same code in Ruby, Boo, Lisp, C# or even F#.
If your problems are easy to express in efficient assembly language, though, more power to you.
Ditto most of what others have said.
In the good old days before C was invented, when the only high level languages were things like COBOL and FORTRAN, there were lots of things that just weren't possible to do without resorting to assembler. It was the only way to get the full breadth of flexibility, to be able to access all the devices, etc. But then C was invented, and almost anything that was possible in assembly was possible in C. I have written very little assembly since then.
That said, I think it is a very useful exercise for new programmers to learn to write in assembler. Not because they would actually use it much, but because then you understand what is really happening inside the computer. I've seen lots of programming errors and inefficient code from programmers who clearly have no idea what's really happening with the bits and bytes and registers.
I've been programming in assembly now for about a month. I often write a piece of code in C and then compile it to assembly to assist me. Perhaps I am not utilizing the full optimizing power of the C compiler but it appears that my C asm source is including unnecessary operations. So I am beginning to see that the talk of a good C compiler outperforming a good assembly coder is not always true.
Anyways, my assembly programs are so fast. And the more I use assembly the less time it takes me to write out my code because it's really not that hard. Also the comment about assembly having poor legibility is not true. If you label your programs correctly and make comments when there is additional elaboration needed you should be all set. In fact in ways assembly is more clear to the programmer because they are seeing what is happening at the level of the processor. I don't know about other programmers but for me I like knowing what's happening, rather than things being in a sort of black box.
With that said the real advantage of compilers is that a compiler can understand patterns and relationships and then automatically code them in the appropriate locations in the source. One popular example are virtual functions in C++ which requires the compiler to optimally map function pointers. However a compiler is limited to doing what the maker of the compiler allows the compiler to do. This leads to programmers sometimes having to resort to doing bizarre things with their code , adding coding time, when they could have been done trivially with assembly.
Personally I think the marketplace heavily supports high level languages. If assembly language was the only language in existence today then their would be about 70% less people programming and who knows where our world would be, probably back in the 90's. Higher level languages appeal to a broader range of people. This allows a higher supply of programmers to build the needed infrastructure of our world. Developing nations like China and India benefit heavily from languages like Java. These countries will fast develop their IT infrastructure and people will become more interconnected. So my point is that high level languages are popular not because they produce superior code but because they help to meet demand in the world's marketplaces.
I'm learning assembly in comp org right now, and while it is interesting, it is also very inefficient to write in. You have to keep alot more details in your head to get things working, and its also slower to write the same things. For example, a simple 6 line for loop in C++ can equal 18 lines or more of assembly.
Personally, its alot of fun learning how things work down at the hardware level, and it gives me greater appreciation for how computing works.
What C has over a good macro assembler is the language C. Type checking. Loop constructs. Automatic stack management. (Nearly) automatic variable management. Dynamic memory techniques in assembler are a massive pain in the butt. Doing a linked list properly is just down right scary compared to C or better yet list foo.insert(). And debugging - well, there's no contest on what is easier to debug. HLLs win hands down there.
I've coded nearly half my career in assembler which makes it very easy for me to think in assmebler. it helps me to see what the C compiler is doing which again helps me write code that the C compiler can efficiently handle. A well thought out routine written in C can be written to output exactly what you want in assembler with a little work - and it's portable! I've already had to rewrite a few older asm routines back to C for cross platform reasons and it's no fun.
No, I'll stick with C and deal with the occasional slight slowdown in performance against the productivity time I gain with HLL.
I can only answer why I personally don't write programs in assembly more often, and the main reason is that it's more tedious to do. Also, I think that it is easier to get things subtly wrong without noticing immediately. E.g., you might change the way you use a register in one routine but forget to change this in one place. It'll assemble fine and you may not notice until much later.
That said, I do think there are still valid uses for assembly. For instance, I have a number of pretty optimised assembly routines for processing large amounts of data, using SIMD and following the paranoid "every bit is sacred"[quote V.Stob] approach. (But note that naive assembly implementations are often a lot worse than what a compiler would generate for you.)
C is a macro assembler! And it's the best one!
It can do nearly everything assembly can, it can be portable and in most of the rare cases where it can't do something you can still use embedded assembly code. This leaves only a small fraction of programs that you absolutely need to write in assembly and nothing but assembly.
And the higher level abstractions and the portability make it more worthwhile for most people to write system software in C. And although you might not need portability now if you invest a lot of time and money in writing some program you might not want to limit yourself in what you'll be able to use it for in the future.
People seem to forget that there is also the other direction.
Why are you writing in Assembler in the first place? Why not write the program in a truly low level language?
Instead of
mov eax, 0x123
add eax, 0x456
push eax
call printInt
you could just as well write
B823010000
0556040000
50
FF15.....
That has so many advantages, you know the exact size of your program, you can reuse the value of instructions as input for other instructions and you do not even need an assembler to write it, you can use any text editor...
And the reason you still prefer Assembler about this, is the reason other people prefer C...
Because it's always that way: time pass and good things pass away too :(
But when you write asm code it's totally different feeling than when you code high-level langs, though you know it's much less productive. It's like you're a painter: you are free to draw anything you like the way you like with absolutely no restrictions(well, only by CPU features)... That is why I love it. It's a pity this language goes away. But while somebody still remembers it and codes it, it will never die!
$$$
A company hires a developer to help turn code into $$$. The faster that useful code can be produced, the faster the company can turn that code into $$$.
Higher level languages are generally better at churning out larger volumes of useful code. This is not to say that assembly does not have its place, for there are times and places where nothing else will do.
The advantage of HLL's is even greater when you compare assembly to a higher level language than C, e.g. Java or Python or Ruby. For instance, these languages have garbage collection: no need to worry about when to free a chunk of memory, and no memory leaks or bugs due to freeing too early.
As others mentioned before, the reason for any tool to exist is how efficiently it can work. As HLLs can accomplish the same jobs as many lines of asm code I guess it's natural for assembly to be superseded by other languages. And for the close-to-hardware fiddling - there's inline assembly in C and other variants as per language.
Dr. Paul Carter in says in the PC Assembly Language
"...a better understanding of how
computers really work at a lower level
than in programming languages like
Pascal. By gaining a deeper
understanding of how computers work,
the reader can often be much more
productive developing software in
higher level languages such as C and
C++. Learning to program in assembly
language is an excellent way to
achieve this goal."
We've got introduction to assembly in my college courses. It'll help to clear concepts. However I doubt any of us would write 90% of code in assembly. How relevant is in-depth assembly knowledge today?
Flipping through these answers, I'd bet 9/10 of the responders have never worked with assembly.
This is an ages old question that comes up every so often and you get the same, mostly misinformed answers. If it weren't for portability, I'd still do everything in assembly myself. Even then, I code in C almost like I did in assembly.
every c program is converted to machine code, if this binary is distributed. Since the instruction set of a computer is well known, is it possible to get back the C original program?
You can never get back to the exact same source since there is no meta-data about that saved with the compiled code.
But you can re-create code out from the assembly-code.
Check out this book if you are interested in these things: Reversing: Secrets of Reverse Engineering.
Edit
Some compilers-101 here, if you were to define a compiler with another word and not as technical as "compiler", what would it be?
Answer: Translator
A compiler translates the syntax / phrases you have written into another language a C compiler translates to Assembly or even Machine-code. C# Code is translated to IL and so forth.
The executable you have is just a translation of your original text / syntax and if you want to "reverse it" hence "translate it back" you will most likely not get the same structure as you had at the start.
A more real life example would be if you Translate from English to German and the from German back to English, the sentance structure will most likely be different, other words might be used but the meaning, the context, will most likely not have changed.
The same goes for a compiler / translator if you go from C to ASM, the logic is the same, it's just a different way of reading it ( and of course its optimized ).
It depends on what you mean by original C program. Things like local variable names, comments, etc... are not included in the binary, so there's no way to get the exact same source code as the one used to produce the binary. Tools such as IDA Pro might help you disassemble a binary.
I would guestimate the conversion rate of a really skilled hacker at about 1 kilobyte of machine code per day. At common Western salaries, that puts the price of, say, a 100 KB executable at about $25,000. After spending that much money, all that's gained is a chunk of C code that does exactly what yours does, minus the benefit of comments and whatnot. It is no way competitive with your version, you'll be able to deliver updates and improvements much quicker. Reverse engineering those updates is a non trivial effort as well.
If that price tag doesn't impress you, you can arbitrarily raise the conversion cost by adding more code. Just keep in mind that skilled hackers that can tackle large programs like this have something much better to do. They write their own code.
One of the best works on this topic that I know about is:
Pigs from sausages? Reengineering from assembler to C via FermaT.
The claim is you get back a reasonable C program, even if the original asm code was not written in C! Lots of caveats apply.
The Hex-Rays decompiler (extension to IDA Pro) can do exactly that. It's still fairly recent and upcoming but showing great promise. It takes a little getting used to but can potentially speed up the reversing process. It's not a "silver bullet" - no c decompiler is, but it's a great asset.
The common name for this procedure is "turning hamburger back into cows." It's possible to reverse engineer binary code into a functionally equivalent C program, but whether that C code bears a close resemblance to the original is an open question.
Working on tools that do this is a research activity. That is, it is possible to get something in the easy cases (you won't recover local variables names unless debug symbols are present, for instance). It's nearly impossible in practice for large programs or if the programmer had decided to make it difficult.
There is not a 1:1 mapping between a C program and the ASM/machine code it will produce - one C program can compile to a different result on different compilers or with different settings) and sometimes two different bits of C could produce the same machine code.
You definitely can generate C code from a compiled EXE. You just can't know how similar in structure it will be to the original code - apart from variable/function names being lost, I assume it won't know the original way the code was split amongst many files.
You can try hex-rays.com, it has a really nice decompiler which can decompile assembly code into C with 99% accuracy.
I googled and I see a surprising amount of flippant responses basically laughing at the asker for asking such a question.
Microchip provides some source code for free (I don't want to post it here in case that's a no-no. Basically, google AN937, click the first link and there's a link for "source code" and its a zipped file). Its in ASM and when I look at it I start to go cross-eyed. I'd like to convert it to something resembling a c type language so that I can follow along. Because lines such as:
GLOBAL _24_bit_sub
movf BARGB2,w
subwf AARGB2,f
are probably very simple but they mean nothing to me.
There may be some automated ASM to C translator out there but all I can find are people saying its impossible. Frankly, its impossible for it to be impossible. Both languages have structure and that structure surely can be translated.
You can absolutely make a c program from assembler. The problem is it may not look like what you are thinking, or maybe it will. My PIC is rusty but using another assembler, say you had
add r1,r2
In C lets say that becomes
r1 = r1 + r2;
Possibly more readable. You lose any sense of variable names perhaps as values are jumping from memory to registers and back and the registers are being reused. If you are talking about the older pics that had what two registers an accumulator and another, well it actually might be easier because variables were in memory for the most part, you look at the address, something like
q = mem[0x12];
e = q;
q = mem[0x13];
e = e + q;
mem[0x12] = e;
Long and drawn out but it is clear that mem[0x12] = mem[0x12] + mem[0x13];
These memory locations are likely variables that will not jump around like compiled C code for a processor with a bunch of registers. The pic might make it easier to figure out the variables and then do a search and replace to name them across the file.
What you are looking for is called a static binary translation, not necessarily a translation from one binary to another (one processor to another) but in this case a translation from pic binary to C. Ideally you would want to take the assembler given in the app note and assemble it to a binary using the microchip tools, then do the translation. You can do dynamic binary translation as well but you are even less likely to find one of those and it doesnt normally result in C but one binary to another. Ever wonder how those $15 joysticks at wal-mart with pac-man and galaga work? The rom from the arcade was converted using static binary translation, optimized and cleaned up and the C or whatever intermediate language compiled for the new target processor in the handheld box. I imagine not all of them were done this way but am pretty sure some were.
The million dollar question, can you find a static binary translator for a pic? Who knows, you probably have to write one yourself. And guess what that means, you write a disassembler, and instead of disassembling to an instruction in the native assembler syntax like add r0,r1 you have your disassembler print out r0=r0+r1; By the time you finish this disassembler though you will know the pic assembly language so well that you wont need the asm to C translator. You have a chicken and egg problem.
Getting the exact same source code back from a compiled program is basically impossible. But decompilers have been an area of research in computer science (e.g. the dcc decompiler, which was a PhD project).
There are various algorithms that can be used to do pattern matching on assembly code and generate equivalent C code, but it is very hard to do this in a general way that works well for all inputs.
You might want to check out Boomerang for a semi-recent open source effort at a generalized decompiler.
I once worked a project where a significant part of the intellectual property was some serious algorithms coded up in x86 assembly code. To port the code to an embedded system, the developer of that code (not me) used a tool from an outfit called MicroAPL (if I recall correctly):
http://www.microapl.co.uk/asm2c/index.html
I was very, very surprised at how well the tool did.
On the other hand, I think it's one of those "if you have to ask, you can't afford it" type of things (their price ranges for a one-off conversion of a project work out to around 4 lines of assembly processed for a dollar).
But, often the assembly routines you get from a vendor are packaged as functions that can be called from C - so as long as the routines do what you want (on the processor you want to use), you might just need to assemble them and more or less forget about them - they're just library functions you call from C.
You can't deterministically convert assembly code to C. Interrupts, self modifying code, and other low level things have no representation other than inline assembly in C. There is only some extent to which an assembly to C process can work. Not to mention the resultant C code will probably be harder to understand than actually reading the assembly code... unless you are using this as a basis to begin reimplementation of the assembly code in C, then it is somewhat useful. Check out the Hex-Rays plugin for IDA.
Yes, it's very possible to reverse-engineer assembler code to good quality C.
I work for a MicroAPL, a company which produces a tool called Relogix to convert assembler code to C. It was mentioned in one of the other posts.
Please take a look at the examples on our web site:
http://www.microapl.co.uk/asm2c/index.html
There must be some automated ASM to C translator out there but all I can find are people saying its impossible. Frankly, its impossible for it to be impossible.
No, it's not. Compilation loses information: there is less information in the final object code than in the C source code. A decompiler cannot magically create that information from nothing, and so true decompilation is impossible.
It isn't impossible, just very hard. A skilled assembly and C programmer could probably do it, or you could look at using a Decompiler. Some of these do quite a good job of converting the asm to C, although you will probably have to rename some variables and methods.
Check out this site for a list of decompilers available for the x86 architecture.
Check out this: decompiler
A decompiler is the name given to a
computer program that performs the
reverse operation to that of a
compiler. That is, it translates a
file containing information at a
relatively low level of abstraction
(usually designed to be computer
readable rather than human readable)
into a form having a higher level of
abstraction (usually designed to be
human readable).
Not easily possible.
One of the great advantages of C over ASM apart from readability was that it prevented "clever" programing tricks.
There are numerous things you can do in assembler that have no direct C equivalent,
or involve tortuous syntax in C.
The other problem is datatypes most assemblers essentialy have only two interchangeable datatypes: bytes and words. There may be some language constructs to define ints and floats
etc. but there is no attempt to check that the memory is used as defined. So its very difficult to map ASM storage to C data types.
In addition all assembler storage is essentially a "struct"; storage is layed out in the order it is defined (unlike C where storage is ordered at the whim of the runtime). Many ASM programs depend on the exact storage layout - to acheive the same effect in C you would need to define all storage as part of a single struct.
Also there are a lot of absused instructions ( on olde worldy IBM manframes the LA, load address, instruction was regulary used to perform simple arithimatic as it was faster and didnt need an overflow register )
While it may be technically possible to translate to C the resulting C code would be less readable than the ASM code that was transalated.
I can say with 99% guarantee, there is no ready converter for this assembly language, so you need to write one. You can simply implement it replacing ASM command with C function:
movf BARGB2,w -> c_movf(BARGB2,w);
subwf AARGB2,f -> c_subwf(AARGB2,f);
This part is easy :)
Then you need to implement each function. You can declare registers as globals to make things easy. Also you can use not functions, but #defines, calling functions if needed. This will help with arguments/results processing.
#define c_subwf(x,y) // I don't know this ASM, but this is some Substraction must be here
Special case is ASM directives/labels, I think it can be converted with #defines only.
The fun starts when you'll reach some CPU-specific features. This can be simple function calls with stack operations, some specific IO/Memory operations. More fun are operations with Program Counter register, used for calculations, or using/counting ticks/latencies.
But there is another way, if this hardcore happens. It's hardcore too :)
There is a technique named dynamic recompilation exists. It's used in many emulators.
You don't need recompile your ASM, but the idea is almost the same. You can use all your #defines from first step, but add support of needed functionality to them (incrementing PC/Ticks). Also you need to add some virtual environment for your code, such as Memory/IO managers, etc.
Good luck :)
I think it is easier to pick up a book on PIC assembly and learn to read it. Assembler is generally quite simple to learn, as it is so low level.
Check out asm2c
Swift tool to transform DOS/PMODEW 386 TASM Assembly code to C code
It is difficult to convert a function from asm to C but doable by hand. Converting an entire program with a decompiler will give you code that can be impossible to understand since to much of the structure was lost during compilation. Without meaningful variable and function names the resultant C code is still very difficult to understand.
The output of a C compiler (especially unoptimised output) of an basic program could be translatable to C because of repeated patterns and structures.