now we are working in one project.in that project we choosed HTML5 and CSS3 designed. but still we have confuse on server side scripting, whether php,ruby,python,scala,and more and more..our requirements is nothing but
SERVER SCRIPTING LANGUAGE:our server side scripting language is secure and more helpfull(ease of development,security,maintenance) in anystage. can you please suggest me which is good at present(21-10-10)? sorry if this question is make argument...
and can you say which is current trend in web development language...not ask about which language...but which trend(first functional programming to oops concepts...is still oops concepts or we switched to any recent trend? )
and i heard by using proper oops class structure with any language we can enhance security? is it true?
i searched lot and lot more than 1 week. but still confuse...
DATABASE: still confuse on which data base is best for us?
sorry to everyone if my question make hurt or make more discussion? and thanks to everyone...
It depends on the complexity of applications, performance requirements, target audience (corporate intranet, internet,...) and budget.
If you can give more details on these then you might get a better suited answer and not a very general one (like this)
And more importantly in which technology you and your team are comfortable with. A Java project and PHP project's success, in completion and performance is more on the team's experience and expertise than on the language itself, to a great extent.
See also these questions: (php vs python) scalability, PHP and Java performance and scalability comparison, and this article by Joel.
Ok, you asked about security:
It is the application architecture and code that decides security at the end of the day, not the language itself.
OOP is a nice paragdim to code, makes developemnt and maintenance (arguably)easier, but end of the day, it is how you implement it, what your architecture is, and how good you coding practices are.
OOP alone will not make your site secure. Nor will the use of any particular language or OS or framework. Only good practices will help you, and most of those apply regardless of paradigm, language, or platform.
As for language popularity, PHP, Python, and Ruby (on Rails) seem pretty popular. As do .net languages, particularly C#. Don't mistake "popular" for "good" or especially "secure", though -- you need to evaluate the languages for yourself, and don't trust what some random geek on the intarwebz tells you, as we're not the ones who'll have to build stuff with it. And above all, follow the best practices for the language/framework you choose, or any benefits it claims to offer will likely be null and void.
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I'm actually working for a little company of 10 people on the area of solar panels solutions in Chile. Am working on linux since 20 years now. When I studied programing I studied a lot with Eiffel which I found really a great language. Since, I'm frustrated from a language to another missing a lot of great concepts it offers like
real object (no string != String; ...)
multi-inheritance
polymorphism
genericity
contract.
Working now with Java because
its mostly free
the community for tutorials and helps is huge
its multi-platform
I'm looking for the pros & cons to convince the instances of my hierarchy (basically talking about justifying the price of the licences which are 1500$=>1y and 2000$=>2y) and to be a bit secured that I don't pretend I'll go with a solution I'll regret at term because it will be hard to get the support I need to get my solutions working. Is ISE Eiffel reliable for production use? Will I have to get hours of pain making work a solution?
What are the pros & cons?
Pros
Concepts helping me to write real good quality code (multi-inheritance, polymorphism, genericity, contract)
Pleasure to develop with such good tools
Quality and reliability of produced code
...
Cons
Poor community, meaning few tutorials
I'm not good in C so digging into the implementation of C libraries is something which will cost me (and to the company)
Price is high and has to be justified
My Curriculum will not be as well as if I have years of experience in Java
Formation of other programmers won't be easy if as most of them dont know these concepts
...
I also work in a small company and we have decided 2 years ago to make the move to Eiffel. We had the exact same questions as you are stating. We now have official licenses and support. I studied the Eiffel Web Framework a long time (from 2014) and knew that the only good way to be able to state that it can be used in production is to just do it.
So that is what we did and now the software is in production and working robust, safe and performs well. In production are web API's based on HAL+JSON and created with the EiffelWeb Framework and a self written framework extended with reusable domain components created for the companies goals.
So ISE Eiffel is certainly reliable for production use and the support is outstanding.
You won't have any hours of pain as you call it, but when you write software with EiffelStudio you get many hours of joy, but all the other aspects of software engineering will be as hard as ever ;-).
About your other cons, my two cents are:
For a curriculum, more important is who you are as a person and if you fit in the current team. In my opinion when someone is educated in a model driven approach and acts and thinks like that, can use that knowledge quickly on any environment. That for me personally is more important then being good at one specific programming language. Although I understand that in some cases we also need specialists to get a job done quickly. It all is a matter of personal choice, both are needed in the industry.
If you need other programmers that get in the team doing this, you can only work with people that want that. I know from experience, that some people want it and other people just won't. My advice is not to put energy into the people that do not want it. Work with the technology, show that it works and maybe they get convinced, else seek for others that do see this.
If the management is not behind the decision to work not only with Eiffel, but also with the ideas of Bertrand Meyer, then don't do it. You will find yourself always fighting against it, while it is very hard for others (not software related) to understand. It is a matter of trust, when there is no trust (at both sides) -> don't do it.
We now also get questions about how the Eiffel environment is handling vulnerabilities, which are compared to the way e.g. Linux and Java communities are handling that. Eiffel is not used as much as those technologies, but the Eiffel software itself is build on the strong quality core of the Eiffel method and language. This can simply not be compared with other environments. But again others do not understand this, so how is this going to be addressed? This is an example where you run into when you will be using the Eiffel technology.
A lot of words, but the plain answer to your question is just : YES it can!
It's certainly reliable enough for production use.
You may well have to write wrappers for C-libraries, depending upon exacly what you want to do.
You mention web services. There is a good web framework. But there is no support (that I know of) for W3C XML schemas, for instance.
I would suggest you try writing a small prototype using the GPL edition (you won't be distributing the prototype, so you will not be restricted by the GPL). Then you should be able to assess for yourself the suitability for your usage.
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We need to implement a one-form app (long form) that persists into Oracle DB. There are no Web services of any kind. The culture is traditionally Java-oriented here but it's open for suggestions.
What are the Pros and Cons of going with:
The traditional MVC Java stack - Spring, Struts2 or SpringMvC, Hibernate
The JS (modern) stack - AngularJS, NodeJS, ReactJS
Any clear explanation of the differences, with the Pros and Cons, would be strongly appreciated.
As I stated, I haven't been able to find a reasonable and understandable comparison.
It's apples and oranges. I'm only posting this as an answer because it outgrew the comment.
First to nitpick a bit, AngularJS is front-end technology, you can use it with any back-end technology (I use it with Struts2). So lets remove that from the comparison.
Second nitpick your comparison is more a JS vs Java choice. If you did your research you could be comparing NodeJS against Play, Vert.x, or similar. Not because those frameworks are "modern" but because they share some of design goals which made NodeJS what it is (Vert.x is very similar in intention, it has comparable speed, non-blocking design, and allows for polyglot programming).
But really there is something more fundamental than the frameworks... and that is the language. If you know JS and you've worked on the front end design did a mockup and then need to develop server side services and aren't more comfortable with another language, well it really doesn't make sense to invest in that heavy lifting when you can start doing something useful right away. It's also the same the other way (from the Java perspective) no matter what the framework you need to invest time, if you already know a Java web framework, why waste your time figuring out something else?
That last question isn't rhetorical, seriously why waste your time? In defence of keeping with JS, you can keep everything in one language, NodeJS is pretty fast, although keeping the comparison fair there are many Java web frameworks Struts2/SpringMVC don't have similar design goals to NodeJS while Play, Vert.x, and I'm sure there are others would be a more fair comparison. JS has a different way of doing things and if you have JS ninjas then it does make sense to do everything that way. As for why Java, it is fast, it has an enormous codebase, there are APIs and frameworks for everything, from meta programming, AI, robotics, security, obviously databases and everything common, there is enormous choice. It is more structured, in the end this means that months later you can generally figure out what you were doing and you can better share work and divisions of labour. But again, does any of that matter? I'm not looking to start an argument with the general public, only you know your requirements. Consider them and also consider human nature and take a reasonable course.
In my experience people use what they know, people I find are often splitting hairs over their favourite framework and someone else's for no other reason that that is what they know. If you're going to use some technical tooling advantage to try an get consensus that is highly unlikely to happen, and I would recommend first to look at your human resource capabilities; I mean you could write it in Java or JS, whatever but happy employees will produce way more regardless! What the majority would rather work with can't be discounted lightly.
This is not a question which stack you use. Pros and cons have nothing with the technology involved rather than humiliating the user experience by choosing one framework over another.
If you get any project from an idea to the production software you should know that many many, many factors apply on making decision on the architecture of the project. All it depends on the proposal that you should write first. The quality of this document will make influence on the further decisions and directions, feed-backs from the end user who is the consumer of the desired product.
No language, no framework, no programmer needed to provide you the user requirements. It's just the software that should do some things. That's all you need to know at the first time.
You can promise the user that you can build the software that is required, but you don't tell how it would be built, which language you use, framework, technology, resources.
You can see what other people is created and how it works and if it fits with what user is required then you luckily copy/paste. Unfortunately, it doesn't work in most cases and you have to pay for every brick in the building.
The most significant part over technology is programming resources. If you have such resources that you already tied a half which technology is preferred to use with the project. Technologies, languages, frameworks are different, and nobody can handle them all with expert level. You can build the software with one framework, then rebuild it from scratch with another and then you can compare. If you can't compare the costs used to build the software than your decision is just opinion based on other opinions.
The pro-vision occurred if you have experience of building production software on different platforms using different languages and different frameworks. Because many languages, frameworks are in most business problem oriented and recommended to use by experts as suitable to solve such kind of problems. There's no any point which one is better, because if you choose one that is more recommended than others and create ugly software using it you can't say that it's worse that others that are less recommended. On the other hand if you choose framework and create the great software that may be lacks some features available in other frameworks you'll win.
Don't play with the technology, use qualified consulting services. This is out of the topics of stackoverflow. Because this information is always commercial. Good luck with your endeavors to find the better software that suits your needs.
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I've been lurking around for several weeks and have been totally blown away by the amount of information and how the community quickly responds. I have noticed that questions like this typically receive sarcastic remarks and sometimes get down voted. Please bear with me as I attempt my first post :)
I little background..
I work at a tiny software company as the "QA department". Our application has a MS SQL back to store customer data and short term loan information for financial service companies. I started working here 6 years ago as a gernal technician to provide support for their call center, so I've been overly exposed to SQL and have become fairly familiar with working with it. You probably wouldn't pay me to develop a enterprise level database, but at this point I've become familiar enough to do most things in SQL.
Why I'm asking my question..
I want to develop an application to store and track our software issues and new dev. I've done research on this website along with asking around and I still feel sort of lost as to which direction I should take. I want the core of the application to be pretty basic at first, to provide various screens between my entities/modules and to create reports to show their various relationships. In the future I want it to be more complex, to provide a web portal of some sort and to start getting into various complex QA software concepts. I've read around and it sounds like I might want some variation of C/VB for the windows portion, but all of the topics have sort of overwhelmed me. Do I want to start with a more basic one that was created 20 or 30 years ago? (I think that's C and C++, right?) or a more recent one like C#? Will I be able to develop a web portal with both of these? (by web portal I'm thinking it would provide access to our database of defects and have username/password sign-in). I've seen that the various .NET languages lean more towards web development, should I start with one of these?
I am at the very beginning of this and I fully understand that I'm jumping into some deep waters here. I want to make sure I don't end up spinning my wheels and that I focus my energy on something that won't end up being a bad idea in 1 or 2 years after I start. So far I've found this website very helpful, if I can pick a direction I know I won't have any problems finding what the next step is. It might help to know that I have no formal or informal programming background (if it wasn't obvious). I'm a 27yo techie who is starting his first venture into programming, go easy on me! Thanks for taking the time to read this :)
I won't recommend that you go to C, C++, or VB. C and C++ are used mainly for developement of system software, compilers, etc. VB is deprecated by now; there is a .net version VB.NET, but my preference is C#.
Looks like you are a Microsoft shop. Steer youself towards using C#. Visual Studio provides great support for development of Web Applications with support for holding state in entities backed by MS SQL.
I would start with a simple example as given in MSDN http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd410597.aspx.
This example uses an Model View Controller based framework that is fairly easy to configure and use. They have great examples.
There is a free framework that also supports MS SQL Entity store http://www.coderun.com/ide/
Enjoy
Don't write a line of code. There are literally hundreds of open source and commercial software packages that already do what you want to do. You'd be better of spending time researching them and finding the package that most closely meets your requirements. A good solution will also be extensible enough that you'll be able to modify it to meet all of your requirements.
Since you work for a small company I can guarantee you that using your limited development hours "writing your own" will be counterproductive. You'd be better off adopting something off the shelf and becoming proficient at it. You'll learn more about developing systems like this once you've become intimately familiar with one of them.
Check out JIRA or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_issue_tracking_systems for some other ideas.
For the benefit of your company I would recommend to use an existing
solution. But if you want to learn and build something of your own, I
would suggest that you check out some popular web application
frameworks, like:
Django
Ruby On Rails
Zend
Good Luck with your project!
Given that your intent is to learn and create something yourself I think you should consider a LAMP stack and PHP with one of the PHP frameworks on top (Cake PHP, code-igniter or the like).
The C++ route is a long hard way (C++ is my language of choice) to learn; as a learning experience I think you will get quicker and more satisfying results with PHP.
I also think that this is a realistic project for someone of your skills over a period of a 6 to 12 months - start with a simple requirement and then build it up to have all the features you need.
If you just want a bug tracking system obviously there are many options that won't demand any development.
How much experience do you have with things like installing Linux, Apache, Mysql, etc? If you are completely new to this, then this will be a much tougher task, because there are many layers you'll have to learn before you can even get to the point of writing an end-to-end application.
I would avoid C/C++/C# because there are a lot of things you would need to learn about basic programming before you even got to the stage where you could make database calls.
On the assumption that you don't have experience with LAMP (Linux/Apache/Mysql/(Perl/Python/PHP)), my suggestion would be to start simply, by using a scripting language like Python or Perl. You can very easily get a database connection, and start writing queries, and extracting data from there. If you are used to Windows, I would install ActivePerl or ActivePython, and start from there. You can start building a command line program that does what you want, and then from there, you can move on to creating a web application that can do something similar.
Building a web application would likely be much easier than writing a Windows application, so after you have gotten comfortable with the scripting language, that's the direction I would go afterwards.
Good luck!
I just know pure PHP, never worked with a framework before, but my boss wants me to create our next project, which will be a lot bigger than everything we did before (means bigger than a page that needs only 5 scripts to work, more like 100 or something like that).
But I'm not sure if I can realise it with pure PHP, now I heard that CakePHP could be helpful for that (structure etc.).
Should I learn this or just use my pure PHP way?
As noted, your definition of the scope and complexity of this project is a little vague, but I'll respond with the general observation that larger projects benefit from more "top-down" structure than smaller ones. I suspect that pretty much every PHP developer on the planet started by hacking straight into index.php, then wrote some code for guestbook.php, and so on. Then you realise how much you're repeating yourself and start refactoring to classes and libraries.
Frameworks are the natural next step up from that. The term covers quite a range of products; some that tie you very closely to a specific way of working, and some that are more a library with some loose front control.
I'd advise you to choose a loose MVC framework, which gives you a good structure to work within, but doesn't overly constrain you, and should allow you to use existing libraries. I've not used CakePHP - my experience is with Zend Framework, which I like a lot (not that it's flawless). However, I have worked with another developer to compare the functionality of Cake and ZF, and from what I've seen Cake has many of the strong points that ZF displays. In fact, in many places it almost seems you could convert code from one to another by changing a few classnames.
I suspect Cake's not a bad choice at all, but I can't recommend it as I don't know enough about it. ZF I do know, pretty well now, so I can recommend it - and the docs are now pretty good.
Before you dive into either Cake or ZF, you'll need some understanding of the MVC design pattern. Jason Sweat's book is a good, if slightly dated introduction, and the ZF manual is also pretty strong.
By the way, it's not a choice between "Cake and Pure PHP". Cake (and ZF) are both "Pure PHP". The difference is between "PHP I wrote", and "PHP someone else wrote" (so I didn't have to). From this, the important bit is that you trust the quality of that "someone else's code", which in this case you'll have to do by recommendation and reputation.
But don't just go asking "What's the best PHP framework?" - that's like asking for the best text editor ;) And I'm sure this response (or question) will get tagged 'subjective' in mere moments.
I've been using Cake for a couple of years. I'd say if you haven't used any MVC framework before, you should definitely learn one to expand your horizon.
It's not really about using the framework for your convenience. It's about seeing how things are done in the framework-land. You'd really gain some insights that you can carry over even if you later decide not to use a framework.
Your description of the project didn't sound too huge. However, learning an MVC framework is some serious learning curve there. Basically you'll feel like you're learning a whole new programming language. So for your situation if you really do decide to try a framework, you might want to factor that in your schedule.
To get you started, I personally think CakePHP has a more elegant solution and has tighter design philosophies. CodeIgniter, on the other hand, seems more natural to "pure PHP-ist" because it's less abstract so it might be easier to pick up.
To answer the titled question though, I'd think any huge project should roll their own from the start instead of using a framework. The whole point of using a framework is because you want to leverage some of the stuffs they have built in for you. But for really huge projects, many of the parts should be customized anyway, so you might found yourself restricted by the framework more than leveraging it.
But then again, I really don't think your project (by your description) is anything near huge. As a ballpark estimate I'd say any project under 50k - 100k hits a day can safely benefit from using a framework.
I do not say CakePHP. But any framework will do. The major benifit will be you will get a default folder structure, skin, language framework (oscommerce etc. do). You will be customizing this framework. Most features will/may there be by default, like email sending, page creation, Menu generation etc.
You did not say what kind of application you plan (may be because of NDA). More details, more accurate answers.
I agree that it shouldn't be a decision whether to use CakePHP, but whether to use a framework at all. There are a multitude of PHP frameworks out there (Cake, Symfony, Codeigniter, Zend, etc.) and each has it's advantages and disadvantages.
If it was me, I'd use a framework just to strictly enforce some MVC rules... with a large project, keeping things structured helps down the road when someone else inherits the system.
The key here, is don't get lulled in by the "code generation" aspects. If you don't know the framework (or don't know the language as well as you could) down the road, the code generation could be more of a headache than it's worth.
Using a PHP framework like cakephp will reduce the amount of code you need to write. In cakephp there are many things that will save time like using elements to display snippets of code that you use often. If the project is really big, it will help tremendously because your code will be shorter and much more clean and organized. It will be much more easy to maintain as well.
I think that pure php would be the best option because if you use a framework you are restricted to their boundaries,
whereas without framework you are free to design anything, if you think that you have the best capability of solving problems and making algorithms then you must go with php not any kind of framework
and if you just want work to be done then you must go with framework i haven't worked on framework by have some knowledge of cake php i didn't liked it as i think i am tied with some rules, i prefer writing my own code and in case you want to do less work in future just write you own rules (its like making your own framework) just save every thing you created in small files and then use them in you other project just like one of the benefit of OOP(Object Oriented Programing)
If you know PHP, you'll learn more about how to implement common design patters if you start reading other peoples code. The more you read, the more you'll get perspective on what good code looks like, and what bad code looks like.
It is tempting to "code-your-own" because you will understand it more fully, but remember, you're not going to be the only one working on this, and one day, you might actually want to work on something else, and having a system which is widely implemented and understood can make it easier to move on.
As far as whether cakePHP a good choice for your particular project, it's hard to say without knowing more than it's going to be "bigger".
Everything depends on the project and the project stake holder. If there is going to be a lot of modification, either during development or after the project goes live, a framework can be pretty limiting to someone without a strong grasp of the theories behind the framework (not a judgement on the programmer, just a statement.)
I was recently diagnosed with a cascading dissociative disorder that causes retrograde amnesia in addition to an existing case of possible anterograde amnesia. Many people have tried to remind me of how great a programmer I was before -- Right now I get the concepts and the idioms, but I want to teach myself whether I know or not. I think I can overcome the amnesia problems in part with it.
My question for you, stackoverflow, is this: I recently found Clojure and it... it feels good to use, even in just copying down the examples from whatever webpage I can find. My goals in learning a functional programming language are to create a simple webserver, an irc AI bot of some variety, and a couchdb-like database system, all of which lightweight and specifically for education. What flaws does Clojure have? Is there a better functional programming language to use right now for education /and/ application?
I think Clojure is a very nice language. If I should point to any defect it is that it's very new, and even though the language seems very mature and production ready, the tools and frameworks around it aren't. So if you are going to make, for instance, a web-app, don't expect to fire three commands and have a "Your first web app is running, now read this documentation to create your models"-page on your browser.
There aren't that many libraries written in Clojure yet either, but that's not a huge problem if you consider that you can use almost anything written in Java.
Haskell currently has a large following and a growing base of libraries and applications. It's also used for education and research. I find it a very nice language to use.
Haskell, Erlang and Clojure are all good choices. I would personally recommend Clojure, you might be able to do some interesting database stuff with the Software Transational Memory system that is part of Clojure.
You list CouchDB in your question, and it's written in Erlang, which is meant to be a pretty engrossing language once you get into it.
I have no personal experience with Clojure, but i really recommend F#. It's quite a powerful language in the style of OCaml. I really like it because it's debugging tools and IDE are second to none, and you can take advantage of practically every library on the (huge) .NET platform.