Is it possible to build a good medium to full sized application using just silverlight as a host?
A few things that would be needed:
- dynamic pages (one silverlight "screen" can switch between screens, like a normal app.
- similar to a java applet which launches from the browser
I see that Telerik sells RadControls for WPF...but this is only useful (to me) if Silverlight can be a rich client platform through the web.
Although still a somewhat immature platform, Silverlight 2.0 supports many of the features that I would expect from a platform needed to create full sized applications.
Data access through web services and local data/object query support with Linq
Many feature rich controls such as datagrid, treeview, etc
A very usable subset of the CLR (common language runtime)
Access to restricted local storage on the client machine
It is cross platform
There are already some great add-ons, like Telerik and the Silverlight Control Toolkit
For your specific scenario, Microsoft has published a tutorial on Multi-page Applications
Absolutely. I've been looking into this and believe that it's as easy to do in Silverlight as it is in any other language. Remember that Silverlight 2 uses C# 3.0 and from that you can build anything that's not included in the Silverlight version of the CLR. Also, the fact that Microsoft gives you access to the .NET source code means that you can compile the missing parts of the .NET libraries with your application. (No idea about the licensing issues with that though.)
I've seen a presentation of a full featured CRM application two days ago. Although it's still alpha: It looks and feels like any office application. I don't know details but for me it's a proof of concept.
Related
Windows.Forms library contain many bugs which effectively prevent applications from working. WinForms Designer is unable to put WebBrowser control on form. NotifyIcon class doesn't work under LXDE (see the bugtracker of KeePass). Clipboard class is incompatible with default manager of Calculate Linux. Drag and Drop have problems in DockPanelSuite. WinForms Designer is not finished because of opacity problems. WPF was never implemented and no plans to do it.
And mono team says "we don't want to develop WinForms, because this is old technology."
How should one port desktop C# application from Windows to Linux? Rewriting it with Gtk# seems to be too hard...
What is easier - to fix mono WinForms, to implement WPF, or to rewrite all applications in the world to Gtk# ?
As you have already found out Mono WinForms implementation is suitable only for very simple applications. Take a look at "Cross-Platform Desktop UIs" blog post from Xamarin employee Mike James who summarizes available solutions:
Traditional approach
WPF or WinForms frontend on Windows, GTK# frontend on Linux and Xamarin.Mac on Mac OS X. IMO this is the best way to go and it may be easier than it looks if you have correctly separated business and presentation layers in your app.
XWT
XWT toolkit uses the same API and provides native look on all platforms but only a limited subset of components is implemented. Its usability for your projects depends on what components you really need.
HTML frontend
Create HTML frontend using simple WebView component or Awesomium HTML UI Engine. This may be a viable option in some cases but I am not sure whether it is possible to implement systray icons with this approach.
QTSHARP
Open source project which aims to implement .NET bindings for multiplatform QT toolkit. I have never tried it but according to project website it seems to be in early stage and currently tested only on Windows.
BTW I am currently using WinForms for Pkcs11Admin application but I plan to use traditional approach as soon as I hit a blocker bug on any of the supported platforms.
I am working on a project where there is requirement of GUI to be created in Silverlight. Some key requirements are:
Extremely rich GUI
Real time visualization process graphics
Support multiple themes
Support different display size
Support charting / trending controls
Same functionality for Desktop / Web using same code base
Same functionality to be available on embedded controller (based on Windows CE)
I understand that using Silverlight we can have same codebase for desktop / web applications. However challenge is to have the Silverlight application (windows and/or web) for Windows CE. I would like to understand what is the best way to implement Silverlight application on Windows CE with as much code reuse as possible.
I would appreciate if you could provide some inputs on what should our architecture approach be for this application development. Also, please let me know if you need more inputs on the requirement side...
"Silverlight" for Windows Embedded (SWE) is a bad name. It's not really what most would call Silverlight. It's simply a XAML-based engine that you can use Blend to develop for. For Windows CE, you must use C++ to develop for SWE. You cannot reuse SWE assemblies in other Silverlight projects. You cannot use other Silverlight assemblies in an SWE project. Your XAML itself will probably have some reusability, but XAML sharing from a code perspective is a challenge in its own right.
I have been using WPF for a while, and I keep on realizing again and again that Microsoft invests its efforst in Silverlight, not in WPF (RIA Services, default theme, controls and more).
I thought it might be a good idea to migrate to Silverlight (i.e. creating standalone desktop apps with Silverlight 4.0), the question is whether this is possible or not.
BTW, I think LightSwitch applications are generated with Silverlight as standalone desktop apps.
From MSDN:
Silverlight 3 applications are no longer restricted to running in a browser. They can be run in a browser or it they can be detached from the browser and run from the desktop. These out-of-browser applications allow you to bring the richness of Silverlight 3 applications directly to the desktop without the restriction of running within a browser.
Link: Building An Out-of-Browser Client With Silverlight 3
It is possible to create standalone desktop apps(Out of browser apps) with silverlight version 3.0 or higher and it works great. Now it is also possible to install the out of browser app even without opening a browser as shown at this blog post .Silverlight is awesome and silverlight apps even run on MACs and Linux(limited support)
However, it is not true that Microsoft is only investing in silverlight. Microsoft is investing in WPF too. Though it is possible to create out of browser applications with silverlight, they have lot of limitations when compared to a full blown WPF applications.Dont forget that silverlight is just a subset of WPF, for example, silverlight doesnt have ADO.NET, Hardware device access etc. So if your application is merely a business application and you dont have to access hardware devices or database directly then silverlight might be an option, however if your application accessing client machines hardware resources directly then you are better off with WPF.
My suggestion is, If you know before hand that it is going to be a desktop application then go with WPF(or may be even XBAP). In my experience, useful applications grow with time, new features are always requested time to time. If in future,a feature is requested that cannot be accomplished with silverlight and can only be accomplished with WPF, then you will be in a big trouble because you need to rewrite your app in WPF and it will be hard for you to convince your CFO to allocate more fund just to implement one feature. Silverlight is not designed to develop desktop applications, its main goal is multi-platform support.
Silverlight 3 supports Out-of-Browser functionality.
Quote from Wikipedia silverlight page :
Silverlight 3 supports Out-of-Browser experiences, i.e., Silverlight applications can be installed to the system for offline access (provided the application manifest is designed to allow local installation) where they run outside the browser.
Also here is a quick howto
Out of browser applications have the same security restrictions as in browser applications.
With Silverlight 4 you can create full trust applications which have full access to the computer.
More on Network Security Access Restrictions in Silverlight
If you mean Out of Browser apps, certainly. The Seesmic Desktop 2 app is an excellent example of one of these apps, with it's own updating mechanism. Seems a no brainer to use the XAP/MEF plug-in Model and Silverlight in this manner.
Seesmic Desktop 2
We're developing an OOB app along the same lines, one internet download and you're done. You're not going to get exactly the same APIs as you get in WPF, though.
As others have pointed out, Silverlight apps can be installed to run 'out-of-browser', but even with elevated trust they still have significant restrictions on what they can do and certainly don't have "full access to the computer".
Creating an app from scratch, you may want to consider parallel Silverlight & WPF builds. The code can more-or-less be shared by adding the .cs files from one project (e.g. WPF) to the other (Silverlight) using "Add As Link". The XAML files cannot be linked this way and need to be duplicated, but that may not involve much more than copying & pasting, depending on your structure. There're good examples of this on the web.
Developing both types in parallel would likely involve a lot less effort than having to abruptly switch types at some point and discovering incompatibilities/limitations too late.
With the new Silverlight 3.0 feature that allows the components to be hosted outside of the browser, our company is looking for details on the differences between this new feature and WPF Windows applications (since Silverlight is partly a subset of WPF).
Is there a good resource that lists the differences between Silverlight 3 outside of the browser and WPF applications? Areas like permissions, functionality, etc.
If there is no web resources, what are some of the key differences?
Silverlight OOB applications have the exact same capabilities as an in-browser Silverlight application, except they lose their ability to communicate with the DOM (via the System.Windows.Browser API).
Here is a brief list of some common things that you don't have access to with Silverlight that you might be planning on using in a WPF application:
Client File System
Client Windows registry
Client Event Log
Client OLEDB
Client SQL Client
This may seem like a long list but it should look fairly familiar to the no-can-do list for any web application platform (a la ASP.NET, JSP, PHP)
Jaime Rodriguez has a very good post covering the key differences and features of both Silverlight and WPF: Here. It's very high level and meant to differentiate between features that a WPF and Silverlight Out-of-Browser application bring to the table.
markti is correct.
Scott Barnes - Rich Platforms Product Manager - Microsoft.
Silverlight 3.0 beta has just been announced at Microsofts Mix Conference in Las Vegas.
Two features of the new beta are 3D-graphics and the ability to run applications outside of the browser, which to me seemed to be two of the major features that WPF (Windows Presentation Foundation) previously offered over silverlight.
I am currently evaluating WPF and Silverlight for possible use in our companies future development activity, and this announcement has left me confused as to the intended direction of these two UI technologies and why I would choose one over the other.
Has anyone implemented a new application using WPF recently, and if so, what drove you to that decision? Given the announced changes to silverlight, Would your decision have changed had you made it now, and if not, why?
Any advice would be appreciated.
The biggest difference I find is the asynchronous model you have to adopt
in your Silverlight application.
It does seems like an advantage (and it can be), but it does make
life very difficult sometimes.
There are also some limitations that can be a real challenge like the absence
of print support.
I would recommend Silverlight over WPF when:
- There is no need for best possible performance (graphics included)
- Can get around the absence of print support (it will come, we just don't know when)
- Camera/Microphone support is not needed
- Can tolerate the assync app/development model
- Can tolerate limitations on WCF (no support for WS-Security at this point)
- There is no need to store huge amount of data on the client.
- There is no need to direct integration with client side applications like Office.
- Has a server to host your application
I would say the main difference is that WPF requires the client to have the .Net 3.0+ framework. Silverlight only requires the runtime. Now that being said, WPF is geared more for controlled environments such as an intranet. Silverlight is meant for the public web. Another difference is that Silverlight is cross platform (Windows, Mac, Linux in the future & Cross browser). WPF is meant for Windows only.
The .Net framework can be a huge download for some users. Silverlight is only 4-5MBs. This is a big difference to run your app on the web, but not a big issue if its an internal application at your company.
Silverlight is Sandboxed which is meant for web use. So if your app requires more permissions you will need WPF.
There are also some differences between Silverlight code and WPF. But from what I've heard, the ultimate goal is to get a Silverlight to run inside of WPF with minimal code changes. But they aren't there just yet.
I have just worked on a WPF project that in hindsight we feel we might have chosen SilverLight for. It is probably more important to know the differences and select the one that is most appropriate for what you're doing.
Here's my starter for ten on some of the important differences - there were originally some differences in the available controls, but that has largely been smoothed out now.
Silverlight
Runs entirely on the client with AJAX
calls to the server for data
Can run on any server, including Windows and Linux / Apache
Uses COMPACT .NET framework
WPF
Runs on the client... usually calls services for data
Runs on Windows XP / Vista with .NET 3.5
Utilises the entire .NET framework
Silverlight is basically a stripped down version of WPF in order to make the runtime libary download as small as possible.
As a result, WPF simply has a lot more functionality available in it and tasks that are simple in WPF often become not so simple in Silverlight.
If running as a web app is not a requirement then the decision is a no-brainer - WPF all the way.
Has anyone implemented a new application using WPF recently, and if so, what drove you to that decision: Well since WPF was desktop only (or browser based using XBAPS - but that was more a deployment system than a real system) that was a good reason to it.
"Would your decision have changed had you made it now, and if not, why?" - No Silverlight, even on the desktop in v3, is still highly sandboxed and so certain functions are going to be hard/impossible to do due to the sandbox. Also the ability to use DirectX parts in WPF will still give another optimisation area which Silverlight and it's 3d won't be able to use.
It's worth noting that Silverlight's 3D is not the full 3D support of WPF, but only projection of 2D into 3D - i.e. take the 2D plane and allow rotation in X, Y & Z directions. WPF has full 3D modelling with materials, view ports, lighting and camera positional support etc.
I'm well along in the development of our first WPF app for release. Silverlight 3 looks great, but for this application I would still have chosen WPF. The application centers around presenting and manipulating very large sets of images hosted on a central server on our clients' networks. Additionally, the software update/change rate will be minimal. Mass import of new images from a local drive, no Internet connectivity requirements, performance concerns, etc. make this a project well suited for WPF.
One of our upcoming projects, however, will require many remote users to access a single data store on our network. The data they work with requires significant validation and error handling, so running that code locally is ideal. They will need the ability to work both on and offline and remain in synch (probably with SQL Data Services). SLOOB (Silverlight Out Of the Browser) will most likely be our choice for that one so they can have all the Silverlight advantages but use it like a regularly installed application, even without an Internet connection.
Both formats have their place: the trick will be to avoid using Silverlight for everything - we have more tools than just 1 hammer. :-)
Another difference is that with SL you only have one 'window', you can't have dialogs (they can be simulated but their size is limited to the main window) and you can't add multi monitor support.
If you have to interact with existing business applications (e.g. open a document in the archive viewer) you need to use WPF.
I recently have built several internal tool using wpf, and I chose it simply because It was easier for me coming from win32 work. I don't really think that the differences are major, and really... everything i have seen/heard indicates that porting between wpf and silverlight is quite easy.
Storage: You only have 25MB of isolated storage out-of-browser. If I remember correctly from some mix09 video, this limit is lower if your app is in-browser.
http://bliny.net/blog/post/Out-of-Browser-with-Silverlight-3.aspx
No FlowDocument: So there are limitations there too.